Becoming a Ninja ( face veiled)
this is an experience that i remembered because of tamer's discussion about the term ninja.
At my first year in Alexandria University a public uni here, i had a friend called Hanaan. She had recently gotten veiled before entering college, she wore regular clothes, nice scarfs and wore make-up and looked very good, compared to all the others that go there.
The year after, i saw her - i only go for exams and field work, so i only see her a few times every semester - i found her still vieled, but she started to wear very long gowns and extremely loose.
The year after that, i didn't see her for an entire term. So i called her up and asked her where she was, and she told me, i got face-veiled, i keep trying to make eye contact with you so you would recognize me but you never do.
This year i have not seen her yet, maybe she dropped out and is reading koraan at home all day- or i still cannot tell her appart from all those face veiled girls in my department.
On the same topic, my first year the tayaar el eslami ( islamic group on campus) put up posters all over, encouraging girls to get veiled and stating how bad they will suffer in hell if they do not get veiled.
And as a matter of fact, more girls got veiled in the first year, where they were more than the un-vieled girls.
The second year the posters said that the veil is not enough, you should wear loose clothes and not show any detail of your body.
Consequently the amount of girls wearing loose clothes and gowns increased.
The third year, they started attacking the regular veil, calling it just like not wearing it at all, and Haraam etc. , and you should be face-veiled to be a good muslim.
They put being veiled with praying, when praying is a corner stone of religion, you have to do it to be a muslim. and being veiled is "supposedly" something you have to do. But if you do not do it, you are still a muslim.
The point of view now is changing, to be a muslim you HAVE to be veiled!
One of the students once said in a class with half of the girls not veieled (me included): "there are plenty of girl out there not veiled, but they are still good girls" one of the other guys objected.
ouch!
That is the evolution of the Islamic movement.
I bet you this is how it started with Iran.
At my first year in Alexandria University a public uni here, i had a friend called Hanaan. She had recently gotten veiled before entering college, she wore regular clothes, nice scarfs and wore make-up and looked very good, compared to all the others that go there.
The year after, i saw her - i only go for exams and field work, so i only see her a few times every semester - i found her still vieled, but she started to wear very long gowns and extremely loose.
The year after that, i didn't see her for an entire term. So i called her up and asked her where she was, and she told me, i got face-veiled, i keep trying to make eye contact with you so you would recognize me but you never do.
This year i have not seen her yet, maybe she dropped out and is reading koraan at home all day- or i still cannot tell her appart from all those face veiled girls in my department.
On the same topic, my first year the tayaar el eslami ( islamic group on campus) put up posters all over, encouraging girls to get veiled and stating how bad they will suffer in hell if they do not get veiled.
And as a matter of fact, more girls got veiled in the first year, where they were more than the un-vieled girls.
The second year the posters said that the veil is not enough, you should wear loose clothes and not show any detail of your body.
Consequently the amount of girls wearing loose clothes and gowns increased.
The third year, they started attacking the regular veil, calling it just like not wearing it at all, and Haraam etc. , and you should be face-veiled to be a good muslim.
They put being veiled with praying, when praying is a corner stone of religion, you have to do it to be a muslim. and being veiled is "supposedly" something you have to do. But if you do not do it, you are still a muslim.
The point of view now is changing, to be a muslim you HAVE to be veiled!
One of the students once said in a class with half of the girls not veieled (me included): "there are plenty of girl out there not veiled, but they are still good girls" one of the other guys objected.
ouch!
That is the evolution of the Islamic movement.
I bet you this is how it started with Iran.
posted by Superluli at
11:03 AM
15 Comments:
1. Thanx babe for using the term "face-veiled"
2. Something that we miss thinking about is the fact that being not vieled is not the norm in Egypt anymore. Tom and I were talking about this at some point and kind of saw that how the chances are that most if not all non-veiled lower socio-economic class women are Christian.
3. I think the belief is that a "good Muslim woman" is a veiled one but a Muslim woman can be unveiled. According to most people there is an important distinction between a Muslim and a good Muslim.
OK with the face veils - its time to make a call here. This is bad. Objectively, universally, bad.
I know its their own choice to do it. But then young people choose to become Neo-Nazis and rapists and white supremacists and some people even decide that they want to shoot themselves in the head. All with their own free choice.
None of this means that the end result is a good thing, socially acceptable or something that should be tolerated in society.
Any logic that sees the need for women to cover themselves head to toe in a baggy black shroud, with only a thin slit cut out for the eyes, is one that enlightened members of society need to actively fight against.
Well...if its their personal choice and they are not harming anyone else...why should we care?!
I think we need to understand them and help them challenge their beliefs for their own benefit but thats the limit...
n thats what I think!!
Me and Tamer are sitting two metres apart, by the way. Modern technology is a wonderful thing.
Tamer, I agree that wearing a face veil is a personal choice. And I agree that the government, or public institutions, should not discriminate against people based on such a choice.
But, I do see the need for some form of action. If lots of girls in Egypt all started cutting themselves with razor blades, or having eating disorders, don't you think people would try and do something to help these people see the error in their personal choices?
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I'm reading Readling Lolita in Tehran at the moment, it's a good insight into the some of the differing views of Iranian students in the University of Tehran at the beginning of the revolution there, excellent book.
I think that being veiled or face veiled should be a personal choice. If women choose to do so because it is a sign of their faith, that is their right, but putting pressure on unveiled women or creating an atmosphere where only veiled women are seen as good muslims is an attitude that should be actively fought against.
my 2 cents: http://assem.nomadlife.org/2005/03/veil-egypt.aspx
I see Tom's point but then I dont see the similarity between a girl slicing her wrists and a girl getting face-veiled.
I completely agree with Karola that personal choices should be respected but then forcing others should be actively fought against
i think toms point was that veiling should be acceptable if its based on convivtion. But he has problems with the thought that much of the increase in veiling is due to immitation rather than conviction!
I agree, with that (if that was your point Tom, but the question is how do u differenciate between both kinds of veiling? I think it is important to realize that there are more than to reasons for this trend of vieling!
I like Assem's point. I've been having these discussions a lot here with our soul Muslim AIESEC-Madison member, and she seems to confirm something I felt when I was in Egypt: People put on a "veil" to make people think they are good muslims and to avoid ridicule/dishonor. Its similar to wearing trendy clothing here in the United States: You do it, not because you believe in it, but to fit in.
They funny thing, that I've heard in places like Saudi Arabia and Iran, these girls will be dressed to the toe in Ninja, but when they are in their private compounds: Out comes the tight, scandalous Prada and Gucci and from there....haram.
I think in Saudi Arabia the situation is different. Women are not given a choice. They are forced to wear it in the streets but in their home they can do whatever they like. If given the choice, some of them wouldn't wear the veil ever.
When I was in Qatar, I found that some women only wore the veil in front of "their" men and in front of foreign men they did not wear the men. Why? Because foreign men aren't real men and only qatari (i don't know what the word is for Qatar people) men are real men. So all of you fake men head over to Qatar.
As long as no one gets harassed on their decision to veiled or not veiled, I have no problem with it.
In my country, Indonesia, which is the largest Muslim country in the world, doesn't have the face-veiled tradition. Either you cover your hair or you don't and no one cares.
i agree with assem and trent, it is out of trend more than belief.
now there are trendy scarfs, there are private health clubs, swimming pools, and specialized shops and even a fashion magazine for veiled girls.
it's definetly a trend, but it's not strange with egypt, egypt has been going back and fourth between being conservative and religious like now and then moving on to a totaly different lifestyle like in the 70ies where they wore mini skits and bikini's all the time.
having a choice is good but it's hard to have a choice when your thoughts are cencored, and when people are brainwashed and ignorant.
Kudos to the conversations out there...for those of you who don't know me, Nisrin is my baby sister aka the black sheep of our family while she has appointed me "Most Arab One" of the 3 Jaara children and here is my 2 liras...
My aunt who is a teacher in Lebanon always comments about how nice it is to wake up in the morning, throw on her robe over some comfy clothes, put on her headscarf and go to work...you have to admit that it beats having to spend time deciding if this looks cute on me or does it make me look fat and you would never have to go out in public while having a bad hair day. But when have discussions about clothes and religion, I always remind her that when she was my age she was not covered and her reply is that they didn't know better but now they do.
Over my last 25 years on this earth I've noticed that Lebanese/Syrian women used to just cover their heads and wear knee length skirts, then in the last 10 to 15 years, the skirts became longer and everything became loser. In Lebanon, I've noticed more and more women have covered and its too the point where I feel that I stick out like a sore thumb for not being covered. When I went to Cairo last December for my NYC friends Egyptian/Pakistani wedding, I was suprised by the number of covered women in the strees of Cairo. My perception was that there was a lot of uncovered women...and then when I went to this wedding, I was suprised by the number of covered women there too.
Even though certain places like Saudi do force women to cover, some of the more liberally perceived Arab countries have had these religious movements where more women are choosing to be covered. In the past 2 years I've seen 5 of my Syrian/Lebanese cousins (ages 21-25) choose to cover on their own. One of the Syrian ones didn't tell her parents, and when she walked into her house with a headscarf on, her own father didn't recognize her. No one ever forced her. She just chose to do it when she was ready and on her own terms.
My aunt (mom's sis) once argued with my grandfather that he should "cover" his daughter since she was the only 1 of the 5 not covered, his reply was that he cannot force her, her husband cannot force her and that it is between her and Allah and if she wants to cover then she will do it when she is ready. My mom always says that she can't force us to do anything and to remember that whatever you do in your life it will remain between you and Allah. As for me, an AIESEC alum, one day I hope to wear the headscarf when I am ready. It maybe next month or in 30 years but it will definately be on my own terms.
I think that women can feel powerful and free while wearing a headscarf, to me not wearing a headscarf does not necessarily mean that you are more powerful or free It just means that you do not wear a headscarf since power and freedom come from within.
After thinking about what Dania said, I'm going to add a little something. 2 of my cousins wore the veil when my aunts (dad's sisters), their mothers, didn't wear the veil. After their daughter's covered, they ended up wearing the veil. Now, I question why my aunt's choose to wear the veil. Did they wear it because they felt like that had to or because they wanted to? What would people say if their daughters wore the veil and they didn't?
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